Why can't I drive this Tapcon into concrete?

Question

I'm trying to drive a 2 1/2" long 3/16" diameter Tapcon into a 50 year-old concrete slab/subfloor to attach a new toilet flange.

The instructions on the case of Tapcons said to drill a hole in the concrete with a 5/32" bit. Did that with a Bosch Bulldog SDS; that part was easy.

Next the instructions say to drive the screw in with a #2 Phillips head bit. So I put a new #2 bit in my Bosch 1191VSR drill and switch it into hammer drill mode. But I can only get the screw about 1/2" in and then it just stops turning, and the bit comes out of the screw head and begins to strip the screw.

I feel like there's some technique I'm missing, or else my bits are defective. But I tried two different ones, and the same thing happened each time. Or maybe it's my drill? From stationary, I can not get the screw turning. I need to back it out a bit and start again. It feels like the torque is too low at slow speeds.

What am I doing wrong?

Answer 1

Aside from not using hammer mode, as suggested in the comments, I will report that I have had HIGHLY variable results with Tapcon's in old poured concrete - I don't recall what they claim to work in, but I begin to suspect that concrete block or green (not yet fully cured) poured concrete is more their cup of tea, or perhaps "concrete made only with "soft" rocks for aggregate." Some work as they should, some stick partway in, some go all the way in and don't hold; I think it's luck of the draw on what the concrete right at that particular hole consists of. Sometimes the threads shear right off (bit of hard aggregate they can't cut into?)

You can switch to driving them with a ratchet, but you may find that the threads shear off, or the entire shaft shears.

Since this is a vertical-down hole, you might try vacuuming it out before driving the Tapcon.

I've gone back to traditional anchors. Our local aggregate tends towards hard rocks, not crushed limestone.

They work OK as big blue overpriced wood screws ;^) which will let me use up the boxes.

Answer 2

All the Tapcons, Conserts, or other brand of concrete screws I have driven over the years, I have never, while following the directions driven a concrete screw no deeper into any concrete that has been well aged over an 1 1/4" in.

The specs that I seen for the most part say the screw is rated to go in between 3/4" to 1" max for the rated hold. To go in deeper since i had the wrong length screw to make do, I drill the shank size to a depth, then the thread size to get the recommended hold into the concrete.

As a rule, I do not use an impact or hammer drill to run the screw in. I have a 1/2" variable speed drill that will power them in all the way or break them off. Which has happened when driving them in too far. My logic is concrete does not like vibration, and any vibration will damage what threads are cut into the concrete and not give the screws the ultimate holding power. It has worked like a charm while setting wood plates using 2 1/2" screws, it draws the flathead screw below the surface of the plate, showing me it is holding well.

Answer 3

Use 1/4" diameter Tapcons (the 3/16" screws are worthless). Drill the hole with a 3/16" masonry drill bit with a hammer drill, one inch farther than the fastener is long, pulling the bit out of the hole several times as you go to clear the spoils, being careful not to ream the sides as you do.

Drive the screw with an impact gun, and stop half a second after you hear a change in pitch, which is when it's bottomed out.

If it doesn't feel right or is still not snug, finish tightening it with a socket wrench. After you drive your ~100th Tapcon, you won't need to do this step, and will seldom snap the heads off the fastener anymore because you were overzealous with the impact gun.

Use hex-head whenever possible, as the Philips type require a hardened #2 bit or you'll break bits left and right.

Assuming you lack an impact driver, and the screw does get stuck half way out, remove the screw (and throw it away if it's a damaged Philips head) and then do ream the sides of the hole a few times and try again. Repeat as necessary, and avoid over reaming before you've tried it again.

• If at any time it feels like or if you think for one moment that you won't be able to fully sink the screw, stop and take it out before you strip the head, because once you do you're screwed.

I used to use compressed air to blow out the hole before I had an impact driver and sometimes used lube, but since I acquired one I've never had to.

Answer 4

Aaaargh, NEVER use hammer on a hammer drill with a Phillips driver bit. Those heads cam out with the slightest provocation, bouncing them up and down will guarantee they part company and trash the head and the bit.

An 'impact driver' is a totally different beast. It hits down when it drives right, synchronised the way a hammer drill isn't.

If the concrete is too old and hard to use, then drill an oversize hole, and use an epoxy-in fastening, expansion bolt, or the good old-fashion expansion plug.

Answer 5

I bought some shorter Tapcons and noticed the shank on the new ones was thicker than the old ones I had. The short ones went in as easy as could be expected but the shank did not break as the old ones did. 1/4" Tapcons with 3/16" drilled hole as they suggest. They must have made them thicker due to breaking.

Answer 6

When drilling down, as for a toilet flange, the cement dust will settle in the drilled hole. When you try to drive the tapcon in, the dust would prevent it from going the depth it needs to go. Try getting as much dust out as possible or drill the hole deeper so the dust is below the depth of the length of the tapcon. Drilling deeper for tapcons is not a problem, drilling not deep enough will make the tapcon spin out therefore negating the fastening ability.

Answer 7

I just installed a new toilet flange over 20+ year old concrete. Used the appropriate concrete bit with a hammer drill. Cleaned out the holes. I too couldn't get the screws to drive in hammer mode or drill mode. I pulled, hammered, cussed... To no avail. I tried backing one out in hammer mode and it drove in!! So guess what? I drove all 4 in that way... Screw in until snug then reverse with down pressure on hammer mode and it's solid as a rock.

Answer 8

I ran into this problem driving into concrete with an impact driver. The screw would just bind up and twist my arm.

Try putting s little bit of water into the freshly drilled hole. After doing that, my screws went in very easily.

Answer 9

Instead of water I sprayed WD40 into the hole. It went in a little farther each time I sprayed a little more onto the shaft of the screw.

Answer 10

perhaps somebody sees this answer, as an alternative to Tapcon. I tried using Tapcons in my garage, and got into a whole lot of trouble. At first I thought I was hitting Rebarb, but it seems that concrete is non-uniform, and contains small hardened particles that are capable of getting tapcons stuck. I had no issues in drilling 3/8" pilot holes, and to visual inspection, they were picture perfect.

After visiting local hardware store - I found an alternative called "Power Stud" or "wedge anchor". I am not sure if I should be posting links, but it seems that both of these names return correct studs. They will go easily in the pilot hole you drill, and if there are any imperfections in the hole, just light taps of hammer can get them in. As you tighten the nut on the top, the skirt part on the stud expands as wider bottom is pulled in. They feel very robust, and for 3/8" power studs have 4000 lb rating - the number as high as tapcon, but seems to have no issues for installation, after the hole is drilled.

Answer 11

Use a hammer drill to pre-drill the holes. Then use an impact drill for the tapcons themselves.